- When I look at the 30 year experiment, which is the independent, and they go dark on the print side. They're going to do a digital experience. You know the challenges that "The Guardian," and "The New York Times" with their challenges. Frankly, Bloomberg adapting to the challenges as well. Where are we going to end up here? Are we going to end up with an elitist, traditional media and everybody else going to a non-profitable digital space?
Tyler Brule: It's looking that way. You referenced "Independent." Of course, people are not familiar with it. Paper goes completely dark.
I'm surprised when you talk about maybe the opportunity that was there. I thought, Tom, that they would probably say let's close. We'll close Monday to Saturday.
But I think they had a real opportunity. They could have done something amazing with their Sunday edition. I mean, people loved "The Independent" on Sunday. Maybe it wasn't the paper that it was seven or eight years ago. But I thought it was a little bit too much.
And I think they left a lot of money on the table. know That paper on the Sunday edition was getting close to being somewhere near break even. I think if you would of come out with a compelling package in London, maybe blown it out, you could have bought it first thing in the morning or at least later in the afternoon if came on the late flight into New York, Tom, I think they could have had an interesting business. I do fear, though, that we are heading to a place where you're going to have 1% or 2% who can afford and support premium media outlets. And then there's going to be just a lot of rubbish sloshing around the bottom.
- Tyler, you lead on dealing with an elite audience. John Micklethwait, editor in chief did that with "The Economist" for years. Where is the courage to address a smart audience? Is that going to evaporate with the profitability challenges?
Tyler Brule: I don't think so. I mean, I can only speak for what we do and the channels that we ply day in and day out. I don't if you've got this sort of on your desk, but you can see. I mean, we've got a very, very thick issue out.
It's the second biggest issue we've ever done. Certainly, from a page count and also a profitability point of view, there is absolutely-- there is money on paper 100%. I'm not convinced this great race to just go and chase clicks. I'm still not convinced by it.
Francine Lacqua: Will there be money on paper in five years? Mike, do you read paper? See, I'm kind of torn. I love [inaudible].
- I do.
Francine Lacqua: --But I read very few of them.
- Full disclosure. Here you go. I brought my paper with me. So-- [laughs] I'm still a paper guy. Maybe I'm the wrong age. But I still read the paper, yeah.
Francine Lacqua: So five years we'll still read magazines if they're glossy and give us good contact?
Tyler Brule: Absolutely. I think if you were sitting on a high speed Trenitalia train running between Milan and Rome, in five years time, there is enormous value I think if you are-- in a way, we talk about this as being print advertising frenzy.
This also outdoor advertising. This out of home because there is an outside back cover as well. So if I'm walking down, I get on a new A350, or I'm on a nice new train from Bombardier, if I see that outside back cover, there's enormous value in that. This doesn't happen on a backlit screen.
- Tyler, hold up--
Tyler Brule: There's nothing there.
- Hold up your magazine again. Folks, this is a hat trick of shameless plugs by Tyler Brule. I mean, come on. Folks--
Tyler Brule: Thanks, Tom.
- --this is over top shameless plug this morning. Tyler, why can't the major media houses copy what you're doing? They seem afraid to lose the lowest common denominator if they go for the elite.
Tyler Brule: That's one part of it, Tom. But as you know, you walk into so many boardrooms of major media companies. And you have that red sports car syndrome.
You've got media owners, non-execs, who are-- whatever, doesn't matter. Whether the north of 50, north of 60, north of 70, they want to think that they're part of the cool kids. They want to show that they're sort of tweeting every second of the day, and they want to sort of seem that they're drinking from the fountain of youth and thinking oh, I don't want to be associated with print. I don't want to be associated with television or radio anymore. That's going to make me look incredibly old.
And I think that's one of the big challenges with media companies is that you have a lot of people who are not on the right side of innovation, who are making the wrong choices. So if I look at right now, we've actually-- I think we're in a position-- look at the United States. We've seen a complete turnaround.
More independent bookstores opening up in the last year than in the last decade. At the same time, I think we've also seen-- we've seen in the UK Waterstones going back into profitability. Foyles going back into profitability.
So I think we've reached a point. We're in this settle down right now.
- OK.
Tyler Brule: You've decided, Francine, you want to read off a tablet. You read off a tablet. But you know what? You can also read off of paper as well.
- OK, within that is--
Tyler Brule: It's not going to be unilateral world.
- Is Tim Cook in Apple your supporter and friend? They want to go for an elite aesthetic. Can they help "Monocle," or are they your enemy?
Tyler Brule: I think they help us on distribution. We have a radio station. And yes, OK, lots of people do like to listen live.
But of course, you know, what, 70%, 80% of our traffic is downloaded. I prefer if they came and downloaded directly from us. But of course, they create a platform where people-- and they have access to our programming through them.
Are they the biggest advertisers? No. But they're there from time to time when they have a new product.
So I would say somewhere between neutral. But I'm not flying around with Tim.
Francine Lacqua: Mike, does it--
[laughter]
Tyler Brule: I'd like to. Maybe Johnny I would invite me. But--
Francine Lacqua: Well, now that he's listened, maybe he will.